Ripoff Dept: Sammy Hagar's "rum project"

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Capn Jimbo
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Ripoff Dept: Sammy Hagar's "rum project"

Post by Capn Jimbo »

(Grabbin crotch) Cabo Wabo this, Sammy!


Actually I kid the Sammy. It was recently reported that Sammy has apparently tired of his very well reviewed Cabo Wabo tequilas, and is now to release a new cane-juice style rum he calls Sammy's Beach Bar Rum.

A publication recently regurgitated distiller copy promoting Sammy's new rum with the typical puffed up backstory, to wit:
Hawaii Beverage Guide, 2011: "While in Hawaii, Mai Tais being his drink, he became passionate about rum. He decided to start a rum project. It took years to come up with the right taste and the right product.

Sammy’s Beach Bar Rum is 100% made in Hawaii. In his opinion, it is the finest sipping rum in the world which at the same time perfects rum cocktails.

Hawaiian sugar cane, the best in the world, is hand harvested then gently pressed near the distillery. They only use first-growth cane and first pressed juice to make the rum using unique handmade pot stills to purify the spirit while leaving in the cane character."
The backstory is typical - the creator becomes "passionate", then spends "years" finding "the best sugar cane in the world", then using "unique handmade pot stills" to create "the finest sipping rum in the world" AND which "perfects cocktails".

So how does he really feel about his rum, lol. But then he makes a fatal mistake...


Hagar steals from moi and The Rum Project"!


Not that I can blame him - after all, The Rum Project is the net's leading independent rum resource on the net. So when he became "...passionate about rum (and) decided to start a rum project." it was perfectly understandable that he'd follow in our hallowed footsteps.

It's kind of like the Jesus story about a single set of footprints on the beach, lol. Just kidding Christians.

Nonetheless we remain interested in any new rum, particularly a cane juice style produced with a pot still (unlike the stifled column stilled cane juice style rums produced in the French islands).
Last edited by Capn Jimbo on Wed May 08, 2013 7:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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You heard it here first! Made with glass!

Post by Capn Jimbo »

Glass my ass...


One of the things you won't read anywhere else is this: Sammy Hagar's Beach Bar Rum will be made by Haliimaile Distillers in - drum roll - pot stills made of glass. Yup...

Glass.

Advanced idiots are aware of small project laboratory distillation setups, usually boiling the wash in what amounts to a small modified glass beaker, all over a good old gas bunsen burner.

The Haliimaile Distillery is currently known for making vodka, and part of their backstory is that their Pau Maui Vodka is super duper pure based on being distilled in glass stills...
Haliimaile: "Our one-of-a-kind glass stills are the brainchild of master distiller Mark Nigbur, designed to create the purest, cleanest vodka in the world. By nature, vodka is supposed to be a clean spirit. But once it touches a traditional copper pot still, its taste is forever altered"
Although these work like pot stills, I'm still having a problem putting them in the same room with the real and traditional pot stills used for hundreds of years. And another thing...

Their claim of purity may not hold water insofar as rum.

That's right. We all know that vodka is defined and intended to be a spirit devoid of taste. Rum is exactly the opposite and is intended to be chock full of lovely aromas and flavors. Advanced idiots also know that the distillation of rum creates sulfur based compounds, and read the following very, very carefully...

Copper is essential in rum/whisky distilling to remove these nasty sulfur compounds.


Bottom line

Glass will not - I repeat - NOT remove rum's sulfur compounds. Glass will not - I repeat - NOT produce a better, cleaner rum. Sorry Sammy - I love your idea, but we here at The Original Rum Project know better. Copy that?


*******
Note: I've written Haliimaile distillers regarding the need for copper to remove rum's sulfur compounds. Stay tuned for their answer...
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Capn Jimbo
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Post by Capn Jimbo »

Glad to hear it...


It's one thing to speculate, another to drink it, thanks for the brief but positive tasting notes. Actually Sammy's Cabo Wabo (when it was his) was very well respected.

Nonetheless the issue at hand was whether the claim that "copper-free glass" will produce a purer spirit is valid, and how this claim stood up insofar as rum. Although the distiller was very cooperative in our several communications back then, he was very busy at that time. It was just before the release of Beach Bar rum, and he never did get back to me on the copper question. There's really a couple basic facts here; and they are not theories or marketing hype.

1. Sulfur is a common issue in most distillations, and it's a matter of degree. Single malts depend on copper stills to remove it. Molasses rums especially have a sulfite problem, but so does cane juice distillate (keep in mind that molasses is a byproduct of cane juice/sugar production).

2. You will note that almost all stills have a copper element(s) somewhere in the system be the pot or lyne arm, parts of the column, or in the condenser. The primary reason for including copper is removal of sulfur compounds and off notes.

The use of copper is nearly universal and is basic distillation science, speaking of which, from the respected "Whisky Science" site:
"Copper removes most of the sulphury, cereal, feinty and meaty aromas during distillation. Especially the copper contact of the first wash still distillation is important. Total removal of copper contact in the spirit still has surprisingly minimal effect on the mentioned off-notes."
Or from Dave Broom ("Rum" and "World Atlas of Whisky"):
"Copper is hugely important in creating (whisky's) flavor. Because copper holds onto heavy elements, distillers can either prolong or restrict the length of the 'conversation' (exposure) between the alcohol vapor and the copper to create a desired character... The longer the conversation, the lighter the final spirit will be... conversely, the shorter the conversation, the heavier the resulting spirit will be."

From "Rum": "the continuous still design (by) increasing copper contact allowed a lighter rum to be made"
There is a tremendous amount of material on the need for copper due to the natural products of yeast fermentation of beer, wine and spirits. These include sulfur dioxide, acetaldehydes and ethyl acetate - all considered negative and unwanted. Some of these can be removed by distillation and cuts, but the industry really depends on copper to effectively bind to and to remove especially sulfur and other nasty elements to create a ligther, purer distillate.

Last, Haliimaile's claim of the "purest, cleanest vodka in the world" is just typical hype, on the level of "glacier water gathered by Vestal virgins". Like whisky, vodka too is made from fermented grain which inescapably produces the aforesaid sulfur compounds that are best removed by the very expensive copper.

In sum, the issue is not whether Sammy's product tastes good to you (in fact, I'd expect it), but rather whether this distiller has copper in the system somewhere? Pictures of the still didn't appear to show any - in fact its absence is promoted - but copper may be present in the condensation system (which is actually the best location).


Bottom Line

My guess: although there may be copper in the condenser, it doesn't appear to be in the glass still. The marketing material sells the "unique glass" still, but doesn't mention the condenser. I took a quick look at photos of their garage setup and their Leibig style condenser's outer (visible) tubing seems to be stainless, not copper. I see no copper tubing. I trust that the product is more than acceptable, but the marketing claims of their Rube Goldberg "glass" still's superiority remain unproven, contradictory and uh, transparent hype.

I'll try writing him again, or call (at that time he gave me his personal phone number).
Last edited by Capn Jimbo on Wed May 08, 2013 7:48 am, edited 9 times in total.
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Post by Capn Jimbo »

FWIW...


Hagar's rum used to be labeled "Produced by Haliimaile Distillers" (of the "glass my ass" stills), but there are reports it is now labeled as by "The LaVecke Corporation", producer of many other labels. Is it the same rum or not? Curious.

Hagar's Beach Bum Rum is marketed as a cane juice rum, distilled in glass, aged for two years. It is worthwhile to note that these garage stills don't look much bigger than 30 or 40 gallons. There are only two or three of them. Each uses a very, very tall glass column filled with what appears to be stainless scrungies for packing to create reflux. The bottom of the still is stainless with a rounded glass half-sphere top (although it may be a full sphere and heated within a stainless heat jacket).

The condenser is a very basic, long and thin hobby type Leibeig condenser (the vapor passes through an inner tubing, while tap water is back circulated in the space between the inner and outer tubing. The distillate is caught in a funnel stuck in the top of an open glass jug. A large hobby distilling setup, except that most hobbyists prefer copper components. And therein lies the rub.


Let's consider the stills used for top quality cane juice rums...

As should be clear by now, copper is almost a standard and is used somewhere or everywhere in most quality commerciall stills for the stated purpose - to remove impurities. Haliimaile's implication that copper ADDS impurities is exactly backwards. Here's the short list of just a few producers of fine cane juice/rhum agricole/cachaca who use copper stills:
Depaz, La Favourite, Duquesne, Neisson, Barbancourt, 10 Cane, Clement, JM Rhum, Charbay, Siesta Key, La Mauny, St Aubin, Poesia (cachaca).
If this distiller has produced a palatable rum without the help of copper, good on him. Home distillers can produce equally palatable spirits with simple equipment too but usually use copper. Further, it's not like Haliimaile has made some amazing new discovery. Small glass stills have been used for well over a hundred years in laboratory settings and for laboratory purposes. The truth: they are best left for chemistry classes and apparently for Haliimaile for purposes known only to themselves, but surely for the challenge, and perhaps more for the marketing.

The good news: Hamiimaile clearly pays attention to their raw materials, ferment, cuts and aging as most hobby and boutique distillers do. But as for their attributing their quality to "copper-free glass" they have made a helluva marketing claim that is just that:

A helluva claim. They'd have done much better by simply exclaiming their own product's virtues rather than trashing almost all the other distillers of fine spirits who depend on copper. And that was the issue.
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Post by Capn Jimbo »

Here's some pics of Mark Nigbur's glass creation...


I have mucho respect for any small distiller, but especially those who don't fall into the ADI trap of being sold an amazingly expensive Carl with the notion that they can create aged spirits in mere months using ultra small barrels. If you have freqented Home Distillers -http://homedistiller.org/forum/index.php - you will be amazed at the talent of the experienced home and small distillers who are known for their competence and willingness to experiment. More than one of the smaller American commercial rum distillers were members there and sought their advice and support.

Halieemaile's glass still and operation is certainly creative for what amounts to a large garage stilling experiment. Take a peek...


Image...Image

Mark Nigbur is the master distiller and creator of his homebuilt glass system. As should be obvious, he has an amazing resemblence to Sammy Hagar (you should see the pics of them side by side).


Image...Image

These are two small fermentation tanks, whose output then goes to a short line of eight homebuilt "beer" stills. These appear to be stainless barrels (home distillers often use old beer kegs). Their job is to "strip" the ferment (beer) and to concentrate the alcohol from perhaps 8 or 10% to say 30%. There are no cuts made here. Please note the long thin stainless condensers that deliver the distillate to ordinary glass jugs. No copper is evident anywhere.


Image...Image

The low wines (or stripping run) then are transferred to just a few (looks like two or three) very small glass stills (they appear to be about 30 gallons each). Do note that the volume (and the number of stills needed) gets smaller at each stage.

It appears the glass is an open sphere, with the bottom half sitting in a stainless heat exchanger. This does not appear to be a fired still. The vapors pass up through an attached, very tall glass column that is packed with what appears to be stainless scrungies (cleaning pads). What this tall column is intended to is to cause "reflux".

Simply, as the vapor rises through the scrungies it cools at a point, condenses to liquid in the form of drops which stream back down the column where they revaporize and rise again. This happens repeatedly and finally only the lightest (and least flavorful) vapors escape.

Although Haliimaile likes to call his setup a "pot still", it is really a modified system with an extremely tall reflux column. This allows a home or boutique distiller to produce thin spirits like vodka in a single run - without multiple distillations (like Tito's which uses either five or six spirit runs).


Flat Ass Bottom Line

Mark's glass system is interesting and creative if only for his use of glass and stainless, as opposed to most small or home distillers who use stainless and copper, or most expensive - all copper. Otherwise his design is no different than hundreds of thousands of other homemade pot and modified pot stills.

Based on Kevin's tasting notes he too makes a palatable spirit, made moreso by proper time in proper large used barrels. It is here that his small warehouse operation becomes commercial. The quality of his Beach Bum Rum as reported would be due to his raw material, yeast and ferment, reflux distillation, final cuts and aging.

There was no need to make unsupportable claims for glass, and false claims against copper - the cornerstone of distilling as we know it. Believe me if copper-free glass produces better spirit, Diageo would buy Corning...
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